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getting obviously too much attention from people like myself, and more importantly, perhaps our politicians. including today our president. why is that? we'll look at some of the reasons, including perhaps the big one, unemployment in a dysfunctioning economy leads to the search for a boogeyman. plus, going inside the world's most controversial factory, suicide, sick workers, 18-hour days. and 31 cents an hour. you thought you had it back. this is the rare inner workings of foxconn. they may have put the iphone in your pocket or the computer on your desk. may have caused a few hundred thousand folks to die last year. what is a college degree really worth? turns out a lot less than you think.
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americans out of money, out of hope, you know the narrative, besides depressing, our current environment is downright dangerous. we're seeing that play out with a war against muslims born out of the own country. that whack job who plans to burn korans is still going. he's pulling a shirley sherrod. stg for a phone call from the president. my goodness. the state department issuing a worldwide travel warning for american this is afternoon. instead of ignoring this guy, our president hauz joined the vatican along with angelina jolie and a string of others deciding he had to weigh in. >> i want him to understand that this stunt that he is talking about pulling could greatly endanger our young men and women in uniform in iraq and afghanistan. >> people just won't shut up about this. it looks like terry jones has a
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new disciple. a baptist minister in tennessee says he'll burn the koran on tuesday, too. easy for fundamentalists in afghanistan who want to kill us. that's after the hate e-mails pored into them. and folks who say the flight 93 memorial in pennsylvania resembles the islamic crescent. the outrage. the justice department currently investigating anti muslim incidents in at least five u.s. cities. whether it's muslims, blacks, gay people, jews, you pick it. history shows when americans or any group of people are down on their luck, they tend to lash out with violence. they tend to try to find the boogeyman the least like they are to blame for it. politicians happy to help. take a look at unimemployment
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over the last 40 years in the country. now look at the same graph with a crime rate plotted. when unemployment goes up, so too do things like crime or, for that matter, social hate. now experts are in fear 2010 is preparing to show a speak needily following the one we saw following 9/11 in 2001. disenfranchisement with both political parties. they are crushing the country for your benefit by controlling your government. why do americans pick innocent scapegoats, random muslims of the world for their anger, instead of rejecting the politicians that enable so many of the things that have caused
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them to lose their homes, their jobs and their true sense of opportunity. joining us now is jack rice. and john post toe is joining us. he heads up the center. do what do you attribute the underlying heat around anti-islamic activity? >> well, i think on the one hand it was something you said about, in effect, we do have a very -- atmosphere. look at the politicians who even when they don't have illegal immigrants in the state that will appeal to the issue. i think here on part 51 is this is the tip of the iceberg. we've had a growing islamaphobia in the united states. it's witnessed by hard lying
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christian minister who is have large followings on tv. two of them were supporters of mccain. muslims want to overrun american. it's seen with political commentators out there on the far right. on tv and in print. for years they've preached this message, and politicians who will exploit it as in the last presidential elections. and now when you have members of mainstream american political parties like newt gingrich compare i comparing muslims who want to build a center in new york to nazis. >> are they trying to match the fringe elements in the middle east here? >> i think back to when i was embedded with the tenth division in iraq, and i'm walking the streets in joint operations with the americans and iraqi soldiers. or when i was in kandahar with
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the 82nd airborne. we were in the streets with the afghan knee counterparts. you start basically making a comparison between islamic beliefs and muslims and terrorists as somehow synonymous. this is a disaster when it come os the american soldier. these muslims will see this and say, well, wait a second? we're talking about 1.5 billion people. let's be very clear here. we can't manufacture enough bullets. we don't have enough boots to put on the necks of every muslim in the world. nor should we want to. what this whack job is doing is putting america in a position that it looks like it hates muslims because they see them as terrorists. >> at the end of the day is it him or people like me?
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is it the president and hillary clinton and everybody else? >> well, it's probably both. the problem that we get here is frequently you'll see politicians who will pander. they are cowards when it comes to it. the other guest was correct in this. it's easy to say it's the muslims, it's the terrorists, it's the mexicans. it's somebody else. all the problems in the world would be solved if -- and if you fill in the blank, then there's nothing to it. we need to stand up and realize this isn't the case. >> how do you overt the deterioration? when you have political leaders so willing to exploit it? >> what we need is more of a reaction to this kind of situation. these are people who have spoken out against it.
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how many members of newt gingrich's party have been very specific in taking issue with what he said? as opposed to if you look at the statements made by some. not all republicans have made statements on this, they tend to talk about respecting our law. many don't talk about respecting the majority of muslims in america. as we know from hard data are educationally and economically as integrated as any other group. the other thing we have to do we have to do is to realize, what have we done here? he has 80 members in a church. if he called your station two months ago or anybody else, nobody would have listened to him or called him back. why should we give them any attention? well, the reason he's getting attention, as we know, is he
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came up with a marketable idea. >> i agree with that if you look at the reaccepttivity to anti-muslim sentiment in the country, it's so easily provoked. >> i agree with you. i think you can tie this to the mosque and ground zero. a perfect example of that. let's think about this a second. we're talking about islam and people saying this is tied directly to terrorists. islam did not create the terrorists. one is not synonymous with the other. a whole group of society is willing to accept one is the equivalent of the other. every time we move into a country and we're trying to create stability or help the country create its own, and we can debate upon that on another
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day f you look back and those people see this and say, oh, we think you're terrorists because you believe in islam, we have already lost. we may as well accept the failure. we have to push back. if we don't, it will get much, much worse. >> playing right into bin laden on this. bin laden will now be able to say, look, i've been telling you all along. they're not waging a war on terrorism. that concern is out there in the muslim world. not as much as jerry jones. you're getting statements from people in congress running to be governor. two wanna-be presidents.
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that says this is not a marginal red neck phenomenon. >> and not just on the right. the left are doing the same thing. harry reid did the same when he could have stood up, and he didn't either. >> we will continue this conversation up for the koran burning or mosque, but for the alarming, reseptivity. a pleasure, guys. thank you for an insightful conversation. coming up, president obama's choice after the midterm elections. will he choose the carter route or the clinton route? especially if republicans do as they appear to be poised to do, and sweep out the dems in the house. will obama regroup? a la bill clinton, or find himself yet another one termer like president carter. we'll mix it up right after this. my name is vonetta, and i suffer from allergies. [ male announcer ] we asked zyrtec® users what they love about their allergy relief, and what it lets them do. the thing i love most about zyrtec® is that it allows me to be outside. [ male announcer ] we bet you'll love zyrtec®, too -- or it's free.
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welcome back. buzz on an extension of the bush tax cuts. will it be carter or clinton when it comes to the democrats and obama. we start with a number of democratic senators saying they support the cuts, due to expire at the end of the year. the president has come out strongly against the $700 billion in tax breaks for the rich. but this morning seemed squirrely about the issue. refusing to say if he would veto the extension. >> does that mean you will veto the tax cuts for the wealthy?
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>> if we are going to add to the deficit by $35 billion, $100 billion, if that's the republican agenda, i have better ways for us to spend. >> but you're not going to veto it. >> there are a bunch of better ways to spend the money. >> how come you don't want to say veto? >> there are other ways to spend the money. >> congress is likely to eliminate the cuts anyway. jonathan capehart and mark tapscott. jonathan, your thoughts on this morning's performance? >> well, i think the president is trying to keep his options open until congress comes back and talks about this. the president made it clear. he wants wage cuts to expire.
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he wants middle class tax cuts to stay in place. who knows what will happen when these folks come back from campaigning and being off. >> mark, is the president setting up to alienate everybody once again? is he pandering to the right and alienating the left and ending up with nobody as he did with health care and financial reform? >> well, dylan, i was reading a noted economic expert's comments about the issue made on msnbc some months ago. that expert said you never want to raise taxes in the middle of a recession. the name of the expert. i have it written down here. it is barack obama. i think he sounded squirrely because he remembered you said
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that. >> is that more squirrely than any president who has been asked that question on a national morning show? >> well, it's always difficult for a president who knows the chief of staff is asking the questions. >> ouch. let's talk about the obama plan. we know the wave of arrival, a tremendous amount of legislative battling and the certainly the passage of a few pieces of legislation. folks have varying views on what the legislation did or didn't do. but one way or the other there's going to be a punch in the face here for the democrats, it appears, come november, jonathan capehart. if you look at the bill clinton push back in '94 and how they dealt with this. clearly this question will continue to be asked. how does obama ensure a higher probability of a lynn on the like path than a jimmy carter
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like path? >> he has to show resolve. the squirreliness will have to end. he'll have to make a determination of what is right. and then fight like hellf it. people don't mind politicians or leaders who make tough decisions and standby them. if he thinks tax cuts for top wage earners should expire, he's got to fight for it. he's got to dig his feet in the sand and issue a veto threat. >> lack of resolution obama's problem, mark? >> i don't think so. i think jonathan is right. he does need the show resolve. he's showing he doesn't care about what the public thinks about things like obamacare.
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clear majority against it month after month. he went right on. we'll see that resolve that jonathan is looking for. >> as he said yesterday in ohio, you know american people didn't elect him to look at polls to figure out what to do. they elected him to lead. that's what democrats on the hill and across the country are waiting for him to do. >> these comparisons fall down in the sense that this doesn't happen in a vacuum. america in 2010 and 2011 is a different place than it was in 1994. the dynamics lose a little bit of comparative value. if they are not able to address the fundamental issue which is the perception, and rightly so of the corrupt objects of the functionality of this congress and this government, that's it, right? >> that's the fundamental issue
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in the campaign. what are washington's incumbents going to do about the fact that they have the least credibility in recorded history. you cannot have a functioning government that goes on and addresses problems effectively, when it does not have credibility with taxpayers. >> how, in your mind, jonathan, could they achieve even a slight improvement in their credibility. could they do something with transparency or the data yesterday? 70% of all government data is wrong or flawed. they don't tell us the data is wrong. >> clearly, there are fundamental problems with the government. fundamental problems with how things are run. if president obama wants to be president clinton and not president carter, he is going to have to, as i said before, show resolve.
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if the president gets the punch in the face, that being the democrats losing the house or maybe the senate, the president and his administration is going to have to change tactics and change tact completely. and i think part of what they're going to need to do, and it's something we talked about a lot is that the president is going to have to improve the communications game. we've seen candidate obama be very, very good at telling the american people who he is, what he wants for the country and how he wants to lead them, but when it comes to governing, as it happens to every president. but for some reason he hasn't been able to translate that rhetorical success as a candidate into success as a president. he's going to have to get that under control, certainly after november 2010. >> gentlemen, always a pleasure.
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thanks, guys. up next, is a four-year degree still a smart investment? especially as ieducation costs skyrocket. we'll look at if it still makes financial sense to take on all the the student debt for a four-year degree. ♪ [ male announcer ] at ge capital, we're out there every day with clients like jetblue -- financing their fleet, sharing our expertise, and working with people who are changing the face of business in america. after 25 years in the aviation business, i kind of feel like if you're not having fun at what you do, then you've got the wrong job. my landing was better than yours. no, it wasn't. yes, it was. was not. yes, it was. what do you think? take one of the big ones out? nah. but these days you need more than the book. you need website development, 1-on-1 marketing advice, search-engine marketing,
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so i take one a day men's 50+ advantage. as a manager, my team counts on me to stay focused. it's the only complete multivitamin with ginkgo to support memory and concentration. plus vitamin d to help maintain healthy blood pressure. [ bat cracks ] that's a hit. one a day men's. parents are now asking if a four-year degree is worth the money. we'll break it down for you. tuition has ballooned way ahead of inflation. the average four-year private college costs over $26,000 per year. and it takes 14 years before a
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college grad's income minus their debt beats out the earning power of a high school diploma. is it worth it? how do you know if it's worth it? joining us now is "wall street journal's" mary pilon. she's written a piece asking what's a degree really worth? your answer is it varies. but what are the variables? if i'm looking at this, is there certain situations where, you know you should really go to school and certain situations where you shouldn't? >> it really varies. medicine, for example. you need education. >> you can say that's for doctors just to charge you. >> another can of worms. one big things people are reassessing and that's ultimately positive private school or community college. seeing how the credits transfer. when i'm on campus paying for
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the experience, am i going to do internships? am i going to look at the network of alumni and perspective jobs? how much should i borrow is the real question. >> that was a big variable in the piece. you talk about how much more money you can make. more access or opportunity with a lot of college statistics. we always leave out the amount of debt laiden on so many of the people. >> absolutely. a lot of projections don't take into account the new rules of borrowing. student loan debt eclipsed credit card debt. it's a sieismic shift. when we talk about young people getting their professional lives starts, do you really want this much more debt?
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that makes the community college look more appealing than maybe going for the biggest brand name possible. >> student lending as a business is very profitable. it's like lending for football stadiums. is that fair? >> it's tricking. we're expecting 17 and 18-year-olds to look at very complex loan agreements. they're on campus. they're excited. >> they want to go to school with their friends. >> we advise people to look at the agreements. quite often the federal loans don't have the market imarketin and glamour of the private loans. what are the payments going to have to be? how much will have have to pay every month? it really makes it morale than
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signing your name on papers and worrying about it later. >> from a practical sense, any insight to determine whether or not it's worth it to go to colle college? >> you want to be realist about what you want out of it? are you going because everybody else is going? do you want training? do you want networking? what is my career path here? there are risks. what if you change majors? what if you decide to go abroad? what if you decide to take five years instead of four? what if i go to a state school and the there's a double-digit tuition increase in the next few years? so what i pay as a senior becomes very different than what i paid as a freshman. you really want to apply logic to it. >> what about just going to the most expensive school. it has to be the best. sarah lawrence costs $55,000 a
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year. they've got to be the best school in the country. nyu, where you went. number two now at $51,000. george washington, $53,000. these schools that are $50,000 a year, those are the best schools in the country, right? >> it totally depends. if you have a very specialized interest and want to pursue philosophy, maybe the best philosophy school is somewhere else. we saw the ivys with large endowmen endowments. they will help out the needier students. really look at your financial aid packages side by side and and assess what you're going to get out of it. >> these are the best schools. >> i'm biased. i went to one. they're great schools. but you're going to get in, you're going to get out of a degree what you put into it, and what programs you're engaged in and interested in. >> they just want to drink and smoke grass. these are 17 and 18-year-old boys and girls.
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what percentage of 18-year-olds will do a cost benefit analysis of this? that's basically your point, which is wake up and smell the coffee. and do this. fair? >> well, maybe the $50,000 schools aren't on the docket. it's a conversation students and parents need to have. >> a pleasure. nice to you. >> thank you. >> mary pilan. if you're going to come on tv, you have to get the guy who hosts the show to say your name right. mary pilan, "wall street journal." a rare look inside one of the most notorious factories in the world. it's called foxconn. 35 cents an hour. ten to a room. check your weather anywhere you want on the iphone. profitability is looking good at apple. the heck with the chinese slaves. plus, barack obama may not be as great a communicator as we
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these scanners have been a point of contention for travelers who feel the pictures are too detailed. all of you never nudes can rest easy. the x-rays that used to show every possible place in the body will be computer generated images with highlights parts of the body that may warrant a
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search. capitalism is a fast moving machine. time for man versus internet. earlier we ask whether burning korans or any religious group should be a hate crime. it started a debate on twitter. and should a tweet be considered a hate crime? i agree with that. that's my opinion. you have something to share, log on and tweet us your thoughts. still ahead, behind closed doors. the world's most controversial factory, foxconn. birthplace of iphones and dell computers. where suicides and workers suffering are simply the cost of doing business.
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these days most everybody has one of these or something like it. play your music, make your calls, check the weather, do whatever you want. but a few tidbits you may not know about this, particularly nor the guy who made it. he's working for as much as 35 hours continuously. doing the same repettive motion at lightning speed while willing yelled at if he talks, stops, or
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goes to the bathroom. makes 31 cents an hour. works in a factory dorm that sleeps 8 to 10 people to room. if he tries form a union and change that, he'll be sentenced to a 12-year prison sentence. which could explain why that employee and 600,000 a jeer jump off the building after they finish making our iphones. really. that's why this was installed with the yellow nets you see there to prevent jumpers from dying. it creates a new sper spective when it comes to checking the cl. responsible for everything from your dell computer to your sony playstation to your iphone has come under intense scrutiny in the wake of a dozen worker suicides earlier this year. now we have a one-on-one interview with the billionaire who owns the place.
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now we have the executive editor of business week and yohan who has written extensively on foxconn. you're the most recent to be there. >> was that in 2006? >> yes. >> after pressure from a lot of companies that do business with apple and hewlett-packard. they introduced a series of reforms. >> let's go through the list. 31 cents an hour. not a lot of money. >> wages increase after the suicides. >> to what? i've received raises on small salary. here's a 24% raise. you're like, that's 12 cents. >> the wages in china are lower than we're accustomed to seeing. it's difficult to use that
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comparison. >> what's not difficult is ten people to a room and eight-hour days. >> one of the original thing, the triple decker bunk beds. we were able to roam the campus and looked at the dorms they are not places i would feel comfortable living in. >> why not? they were cramped. they remind me of campus dorm rooms some young people in the country are in. >> do you feel encouraged by the potential improvement since you were there. >> well, i should be clear. i haven't reported for the factories. if i show up, we are shown a fake dormitory. it's how steve jobz can say i
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don't understand how people can kill themselves in this place. it's a great place to be. so you get shown a fake thing. so we have to look at the the testimony of chinese people sent there undercover by groups like the national labor committee. if you read the national labor committee report, the people who work there regard it as a prison. one of the first things the investigators were told is a teenager came up to him and said we are like prisoners here. we're like livestock. we're not treated like workers. what is basically happening in the factories is that we, you and me, are shopping until they drop. look at one guy who didn't kill himself. he died in may. he was 27 years old. he worked there a long time. never had any problems. his job was to turn a notch that went into the ipad. the iphone that your viewers own. he worked 35-hour shifts.
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one day after a 35-hour shift he dropped dead. china daily says 600,000 people are worked to death every year in china. they actually have a word for it. it's become part of the common zis course on the way the goods we use are manufactured. >> that was a lot. do you get the sense that you were, "a" shown a fake. you weren't there. josh was there. but, do -- would you know? of course we don't know. they have a million workers all over china. we went to one significant campus. we were able to go around unsupervised. we spoke to 25 people who worked there. both on the job, in the
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dormitories. in the recreational facilities they have there. the work is monotonous, it's tough, the hours are long i don't think people are being worked to death still, but i have no way of knowing. one thing we realize in doing this reporting was labor practices in china are tough. they definitely are. the small ter company and the further away from major cities, the more likely there are to be abuses. foxconn is kind of in the sights of the western media. of the companies who do not like this bad public relations. >> that's true. so there's a lot of pressure on them to behave better. >> although it's profitable. it's good for the stock price. >> go ahead. >> i'm sorry, dylan there's a
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really important point here. there's a huge movement in china of chinese workers saying we're not going to be treated like this anymore. there have been 126,000 strikes in china this year. saying there are no human rights here. we won't take this anymore. and it's really important that you know, american corporations, particularly the chamber of commerce have been leading a massive lobbying campaign within china saying don't let them form unions. they are allowing feel to form trade unions. u.s. corporations are going crazy. they are threatening to leave the country. they want to continue keeping the people chained to the desks. it keeps their profits high and costs low. >> carry on. >> sorry. it's very important that americans know, this is a struggle that you are part of, whether you like it or not.
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everything in your house, everything in my house, all the electronic ganlts and make our society zing and bling are made by these people in these conditions. you can let your corporation speak for you and let them keep these people suppressed. or you can support groups who say, no, we should be on the side for people with basic human freedoms. like the freedom to have a break on a 12-hour shift. the freedom to go to the toilet on a 12-hour shift. a 35-hour shift will kill you. >> does it surprise you u.s. multi nationals have been lobbying for for consumer practices in china? >> i guess it doesn't. i think one big issue is companies always try to find lower wages. that's true of companies everywhere in every country. >> we used to take slaves in the
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country. no more slaves here. we'll take the slaves over there. i think my colleague is using the more scandalous of his reports. which is true. >> what's the counter narrative? >> i just think there's a lot of pressure, a lot of scrutiny. he's absolutely right about the change in sort of the attitudes and the i proech of the young workers. they don't want to be trapped. they're not going to be. whether through labor unions. foxconn is moving into retail in china. one reason is because they have a lot of worker who is don't want to work in factories anymore, who basically refuse to work in factories anymore, who are good employees. it's a way to leverage labor for us there, too. you can look at that as a manipulative move on their part. it may well be.
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it shows there's a really accelerating change there. >> probably because it's being talked about. that means we may be getting ready to do something actually. thank you for the time and the reporting m and the magazine is out now. yes? hugo is if executive editor. coming up on "hardball," chris matthews with more on the gop's plan to make obama a one-term presidency, baby. first bob joins us for a daily rant. what happened to the president's skills as a great communicator? [ female announcer ] it starts with you falling in love with the most customized piece of furniture you will ever own. get that one piece right and the rest of the room will just fall into place. see your ethan allen design center for two beautiful ways to save.
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time for our daily rant. looking at barack obama as the not so great communicator. during the campaign his speeches captivated our nation, but two years later many have tuned the president out and accused him of not saying anything at all. bob franken is here with a look at what goes wrong. >> i would prefer to consider it as thoughtful commentary. >> so it will be. >> how could it be that the rock star candidate, barack obama, the man whose words inspire sod many in the campaign and move sod many mountains would morph into a president who can't move ant hill or legislation that would seem to be a no brainer.
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a great communicator he is not. how else can we explain his inability to roll over if republicans for their insis ttee on keeping the taxes for americans low. the fat cats are keeping too much of their kibl thanks to the republican party. everybody else should be up in arms. instead the gop members of congress managed to confuse the issues so much that middle class americans are deceived into believing they get burned unless the upper classes get to horde more treasure. the country is in a deep financial problem right now and a little bit more more suppose who manage to prosper wouldn't hurt a bit. it's real money for those lower down the ladder. this is not a tough message to sell. somehow barack obama has become a mumbler.
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he's allowing us to go backwards. you know, dylan. >> so, to what do you attribute the communication failure? >> well, this is my grand theory. i think maybe the man is too smart for politics. sometimes one of the explanations why anchormen are viewed, is that they're too dumb to know how many things can go wrong. the successful politician can keep it simple minded and not think of all the ramifications. >> if you were to look, though, in other words, you're saying his inability to communicate, your hypothesis is because his brain interferes with the simple communication. >> he almost has the disadvantage of a great education. politically it can be harmful.
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>> come on. a great education is never a disadvantage if you're going to attempt to be in charge or to lead something where you are being informed and having problem solving skill set is a value. there's an argument it's more a fujs of the broken political system. >> the political system is broken. the coverage is broken. bill clinton was well educated. he had a real i feel your pain kind of empathy. even though he went to ivy league and all this kind of thing. yet, he was able to somehow do that. barack obama in the estimation of many people doesn't have that. he's too cool and detached. is that an intellectual problem or an emotional problem? bill clinton was more able to emote to your point, to connect,
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and he's mr. cool. >> one of the hallmarks of a good leader, beyond dissecting all the issues is the ability to create a consensus. it's obvious that is not happening. >> how would you help him? >> how would i help? suggest doing so h many in our business do, that's dumb down a little bit. >> you're saying a simpler message that is repeated. take a cue from sarah palin and alter your message. >> well, that's painful. but she's been able to succeed. i don't think it's an accident she was a reporter one day. >> meaning her stupidity in her presentation is an advantage. >> i'll accept simplicity. i'm not going to be suicidal and call it -- >> fair enough. me neither. but the simplicity is a huge advantage for

The Dylan Ratigan Show
MSNBC September 9, 2010 4:00pm-5:00pm EDT

News/Business. The day's most important issues and breaking news stories. New.

TOPIC FREQUENCY China 10, Us 9, America 4, Jonathan 3, Dylan 3, Purina 3, Barack Obama 3, Obama 3, Clinton 3, Islam 3, U.s. 3, Carter 2, New Orleans 2, Newt Gingrich 2, Koran 2, Bp 2, Afghanistan 2, Dell 2, Washington 2, Jonathan Capehart 2
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